I was just watching 20/20 about
Barack Obama and John McCain and I will say this... John McCain is an honorable, brave man. What he did while a POW was just amazing. But I don't agree with his politics, his constant changing of stances on the issues, his poor choice for VP, and that he should be elected President just because he served in the military. I think
Obama is a more steady hand and is a much better choice to be our President.
In any case, here are my thoughts as we went along watching the debate... as I'm going along, I'm doing my best to summarize comments but they may not be 100% accurate... but they should be pretty darn close...
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9:01: Jim
Lehrer is giving his introduction and the instructions... I'm not a big fan of how structured these debates are. I think they should be a little more free form. Allow the candidates to interact and interject on each other. THEN you'll get a real feel for who they are.
Hey! McCain showed up! You can't see my eye rolling.
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9:02: First question:
Lehrer gave a quote I didn't catch. OH! But he's starting off strong with a question about the financial plan.
Obama first, giving his positions... nothing new for me, ... golden parachutes shouldn't be allowed... take care of homeowners... of course, what
about he homeowners who did the right things and are still struggling?... Says he's looking out for the middle-class. EXACTLY! Good!
McCain's turn... talks about Ted Kennedy not doing well... that's sad... he's talking about the two Parties working together now ... Will he take sole credit for it at some point? The man who has said he doesn't know much about the economy and that it's strong?... Now he's given credit to the House Republicans for joining the effort... even though they're the ones that have been fighting it... and he just mentioned needing oil independence. I'm not sure what that has to do with the economic issues...
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9:09: Asking about their feelings of the plan...
Obama first... asks the question: how did we get into this situation? He says he warned 2 years ago about the sub-prime mortgage problem... says the current framework where regulation is always bad is part of the problem.
McCain's saying he's not sure if he's going to vote for the plan. Now he's saying he warned about Fannie and Freddie. Uh huh... Now he's mentioned responsibility and Eisenhower ... how Dwight wrote two letters congratulating on D-Day and a resignation letter. Says we've lost accountability. No doubt! Greed and excess are rewarded. He says as President, people are going to be held accountable. Well, gee, they're trying to get that into this new economic package, so don't you think so?
Obama getting to
rebut...
He agrees with McCain, but not only when there's a crisis. Mentions lowered salaries, health care, energy policies that don't work... he mentions McCain saying 10 days ago that the fundamentals of the economy are not sound and
Lehrer tells him to say that to McCain... so he repeats it directly to McCain... McCain says her heard him... I love that.
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9:14 PM: Lehrer directs the issue back to McCain. He says we have fundamental problems in the system. Didn't he says 10 days ago, as
Obama point out, that the fundamentals are strong? HA! He says he has a fundamental belief in the strength of the American worker. He has a fundamental belief in the American system. But no solutions or possible comebacks at
Obama on that topic.
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9:16: What would you do to get us out of this crisis? McCain first... get Washington spending out of control. No kidding! Spending is ridiculous. No wonder there is a record deficit. He's talking about how
gov't changed Republicans instead of the other way around. Talking about earmarks... He says he's going to kill all earmarks. YOU CAN'T! Some are needed.
Now he's mentioned
Obama's earmark record. Apparently, according to McCain,
Obama has requested over $900 mil in earmarks.
Obama says, yes, earmarks have been abused. Says he suspended his requests because of the abuse. Says McCain is proposing $300 billion in tax cuts for wealthiest people and companies. Says
CEOs would get tax cuts under McCain's plan while his plan will cut taxes for 95% of Americans. AMEN!
McCain again. Says
Obama suspended the earmark requests after he ran for President. Hits
Obama for thinking $932 mil is not a lot of money. Says system has to be cleaned up and he has fought it through his career. Says
Obama didn't mention $800 billion in new spending for programs.
Oooh!
Obama interrupted him! Says he wants to be clear. He wants to close corporate loopholes that allow jobs to go overseas. Make sure we have
health care for everyone to have basic coverage. Wants to go back to the original point. Says he'll make sure that he reviews how money is being spent on programs. Says can't just eliminate earmarks to help middle-class. Accuses McCain of helping the wealthy with his tax plan and neglecting the people who are struggling. Continues the Bush plan
--- I've had to pause the show a few times to catch up with my typing. Because of that, I'm going to leave the times out from now on. New topics or questions will have a dash on it.
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Lehrer asked McCain to explain his tax policies.
Talking about the business taxes. Says US businesses pay 2
nd highest tax rate at 35%. Says Ireland's is much lower. Says he wants to cut the tax to create jobs. Says
Obama is a recent covert to be against pork-barrel spending. Wants to give families tax credits to purchase health care... because that's so affordable!
Obama now making points. Talking directly to the camera. Says on paper, yes, taxes are high, but because of loopholes, that business actually have one of the LOWEST corporate tax rates in the world. But McCain doesn't want to close them. So effectively, he's making the taxes for businesses just lower.
Now he's talking about McCain's health plan... says McCain wants to tax health benefits. WHAT!?!? And if you lose your job, you lose your benefits and you have to buy your own. Says it's not a good deal for Americans.
Lehrer wants to move on, but McCain wants to bring up another topic. Talking about an energy bill. Says there were lots of breaks for oil companies. Says he voted against it and
Obama voted for it. Says he's the one who has tried to keep spending under control. Says American have to choose if they want the existing tax code or a new one. A NEW ONE! Then he said that
Obama voted to raise the taxes on people making less than $42K a year.
Obama says that's just not true!
Obama's turn again... he says if he wants to talk about oil company profits, under McCain's plan, oil companies would get another $4 billion in tax cuts.
Obama says he was opposed to those tax breaks.
- Back to
Lehrer. What are you going to have to give up as far as priorities because of the financial rescue plan?
Obama says that's hard to anticipate because they don't know what the budget will be next year. But says we have to have priorities. Energy independence. Wants to have that in 10 years. Solar, wind, bio-diesel. Have to fix
health care. Make sure we're investing in education. Science and technology. Make college affordable. Need to rebuild our infrastructure. Roads, broadband, electricity. Need to eliminate programs that don't work and others are more efficient.
McCain's turn... need to cut spending. Says
Obama has the most liberal voting record in the Senate. Not sure that is true or not... opposes ethanol subsidies. Says defense costs are out of control. Need fix-cost contracts for defense spending. Says HE saved the taxpayers $6.8 billion by fighting a contract between Boeing and D.O.D. Says he knows how to do this because he's been involved for a long time.
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Lehrer says neither one of them are suggesting major changes.
Obama says things will be delayed...
Lehrer says, like what? Says energy independence is a major project but that it can't be completely stopped. Says health insurance companies are skimming billions... Says he worked with a conservative Republican (Tom
Coburn?) to setup a rulebook for
gov't so taxpayers can see who's promoting spending projects.
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Lehrer says, what he's trying to get at is how the economic plan will effect their spending plans and what they'll change.
McCain suggests a spending freeze on everything but defense, veteran programs, and entitlement..
something... I didn't hear it.
Obama says the problem is that there are underfunded programs. Like early childhood education. He'd also like saving in Iraq. Says we need to bring war to a close.
McCain says we're sending money overseas even to countries that don't like us much and some of that money is ending up in the hands of terrorists. THEN DON'T SEND IT! He mentions other alternate fuel sources and that we need to start off-shore drilling. Suggesting nuclear power plants. Says it affects climate change as well as oil i
ndependence.
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Lehrer trying to represent the question... asking again how the financial plan will affect their
Presidency.
Obama first... says if the plan works right and
gov't makes money,
that'll take time. He says he'll have to make tough decisions. Have to know what our values and priorities are. Says if we spend $300 billion in tax cuts for people who don't need or ask for them and leave out
health care, then it's a bad decision.
McCain wants to make sure the
health care system is not handed over to the
gov't. Wants to make sure the plan choices are in the hands of families Says he's fought to cut spending. Says
Obama has over $800 billion in new spending plans. Says a healthy economy without raising taxes is the best recipe to help the economy. Says spending restraint is vital. We owe China $500 billion. Says he's fought excessive spending his whole career.
Obama again... says to McCain that it's his President, who he voted with 90% of the time, who presided over the increase in spending and he voted for almost all of his budgets. THIS IS GREAT! And
Obama says now McCain says he's going to lead on controlling spending and balancing tax cuts, when for the past 8 years that hasn't happened, it's hard to swallow. That's brilliant!
Now McCain. Says he's opposed spending, climate change, torture of prisoners,
Guantanamo Bay, etc. Says he has a long record of being a Maverick.
Winner:
Obama!
- New question: What are the lessons of Iraq?
McCain: You cannot have a failed strategy that will then cause you to near lose a conflict. Says we celebrated our initial success and then things were mishandled. Says he went to Iraq and said we need to change strategy. Says they came up with a new one that has succeeded. Says we'll come home with victory and honor. Says we'll see a stable ally in the region. Says if we lost, there would have been increased Iranian influence, more sectarian violence... says we're winning and will come home successful.
Obama says they have a fundamental difference here. Says he opposed the war 6 years ago. Says we didn't know the cost, exit strategy, foreign relations, didn't finish in Afghanistan. Says it would be a distraction. Says he was right. Says we've spent over $600 billion, lost thousands, says Al
Qaida is stronger, we're still spending billions there every month. We're borrowing money overseas. Says the lesson to be drawn is we should not be hesitant to use military, but need to use it wisely.
McCain says next President doesn't have to decide if to go into Iraq. Says next President will have to decide when to leave. Says
Obama said surge wouldn't work, .. would increase sectarian violence, said it was doomed to fail... he still says he'd decide against the surge today. Says
Obama didn't go to Iraq for 900 days and is a chairman of a committee that oversights NATO for Afghanistan and has never had a hearing.
Obama again... says issues on Iraq and Afghanistan don't go through his sub-committee. Says troops have done a brilliant job. Says the surge was a tactic to clean up the damage of the previous four years of
mismanagement. Says McCain said the war would be quick and easy, we knew where the
WMDs were, that we would be greeted as liberators, that there was no history of violence between Sunnis and Shiites... after making each of these statements,
Obama said McCain was wrong.. HA!...
Obama says if the question is who is best
equipped on how to use our military, we can see the judgements.
McCain says
Obama doesn't know the difference between a tactic and a strategy. Now talking about troops re-upping. Says they said the want to win. Says
Obama says refuses to acknowledge that we're winning in Iraq. Says the same strategy will be employed in Afghanistan. Now accuses
Obama of voting against troop funding issue.
Obama says McCain opposed funding for troops because they had a time table. Says
Obama opposed funding for troops without a timetable. Says Afghanistan is deteriorating. Says we rushed into Iraq. Says McCain says there was no threat there.
Obama says we should end the war responsibility. Says in 16 months that we should be able to reduce troops. Says leaders in Afghanistan need more troops.
McCain... says
Obama's plan is dangerous. Says both Gen.
Patraeus and Bin Laden says Iraq is central. Says
Obama wants to grab defeat from the jaws of victory by adapting his plan. Says it will widen the war. Including Afghanistan.
- New topic: Should more troops be sent to Afghanistan?
Obama first. Yes. Need to do it as quickly as possible. Says the situation is getting worse. Highest troop fatality since 2002. Would send 2 or 3 additional brigades. Says there was no Al
Quaida in Iraq before we attacked. Need to press Afghan
gov't. Need to deal with poppy trade. Need to deal with Pakistan because Taliban and Al
Qaida have safe haven there and they don't do enough about it.
McCain now... won't repeat mistake he regrets. That we washed hands of Afghanistan when Russians left. Says he's not prepared to threaten Pakistan as
Obama has done be saying he'd launch military strikes there. Says border areas have not been governed. Tribes run them. Says
Obama doesn't understand new strategy there. We need their co-operation. Says terrorists do not want new Pakistani
gov't to co-operate with us. Says it's not just troops that matter. Need new strategy. Says he would not publicly state that he would attack Pakistan... implying that
Obama did say that.
Obama says he did not say he would attack in Pakistan. He says that if the US has Al
Qaida in our sites and Pakistan is unable or unwilling to react, we should take them out. Says Presidents have to be
prudent in what they say, but coming from McCain, who has threatened extinction for N Korea and singing songs about bombing Iran, he doesn't know how credible that it is. He thinks it's the right strategy. Says there are cross border attacks on our troops. Says we can take that or we can make decisions. Says we coddled
Musharraf and alienated the Pakistani population because we supported a dictator and lost legitimacy there. Says that will change when he is President.
McCain says there was a failed state in Pakistan when
Musharraf took over. Now talking about bombing Iran and his record... talking about the things he supported ... voted against Marines in Lebanon, where 300 died... supported 1st Gulf War... going into Bosnia to stop genocide... supported
Kosovo and ethnic cleansing... Somalia... has a record of being involved in national security issues and sending military into harm's way. Says a Mother gave him a bracelet with her son's name on it and asked him to make sure his son's death in Iraq was not in vain. Says we'll win war and not come back in defeat.
Obama says he has a bracelet, too, and that mother asked him to make sure that other mothers don't have to go through what she's going through. Says no US soldier ever dies in vain. We honor all the service they provide. But the question is are we making good judgements on how to keep America safe? His original point was we took our eye off Afghanistan and who was responsible for 9/11. Says it's not true that McCain's been concerned about Afghanistan. Says McCain said we can muddle through there.
Obama says you can't muddle through. Says he will take it seriously.
McCain says he thinks
Obama should have gone to Afghanistan as sub-
committee chairman. Says when he's sub-committee chairman for something, he would. Knock on
Obama! Says he's visited these places and knows what our security requirements and needs are. Says we need a new strategy. Says if we suffer defeat in Iraq, which we will if we leave when
Obama says we should, that it would have a calamitous affect on Afghanistan and American interests.
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Lehrer says they have had equal time, but the 5 minute intervals have gone over.
- New question: What is the threat from Iran?
McCain first: if Iran acquires nuclear weapons, it's a threat to Israel and that others in the region would feel they need to acquire them, too. Says the Russians are preventing action in the UN Security
Council. Says he proposes league of democracy for countries with similar ideals. Says that could impose significant sanctions on Iran. Says Iran has lousy government. Says democracies around the world can affect Iran behaviour. Says they are after nuclear weapons. Says they are putting lethal IEDs in Iraq. Says Obama opposed amendment to declare Iranian National Guard as terrorist organization because it would be provocative.
Obama next... say ING is terrorist organization and said it consistantly. Says what has strengthened Iran is war in Iraq because they were enemies. Says they've since been able to develop nuclear program because of that. Says Iran cannot be nuclear. That threatens Israel and could start Middle East arms race. Says we need tougher sanctions but need Russia and China. Also need to engage in tough, direct diplomacy in Iran. Not talking does not punish them. It has accelerated their desire to get nuclear weapons and he'll change that.
Back to McCain... Says Obama said he's sit with other leaders without preconditions. Iran's leader (I'm not attempting his name) is espousing exterminating Iran and talking to them legitmizes their behaviour. McCain says he would not do that.
Obama again... he says Iran's leader is not most powerful person in Iraq but that he'd talk to anyone that would help keep America save. Says 5 recent Secretaries of State said that we should meet without preconditions. Says there's a difference between preconditions and preparation. Says it may not work with Iran. Says he was called naive when he said they need to explore contacts with Iran, but now Bush is doing something about that. Says we haven't done it, like in North Korea, they quadrupled their nuclear capacity, tested, and sent nuclear secrets to Syria. Says that lots of people says this is important, but McCain denies it. Says McCain said he would not meet with the PM of Spain (which is true) because he wasn't sure if they were aligned with us.
McCain's turn... says Henry Kissinger didn't say that. Says he said there could be lower level meetings. McCain says he's encouraged that. He says what Obama doesn't understand that if you don't set preconditions you legitimize their bad comments/thoughts, which is dangerous. Says North Koreans have broken every agreement they have agreed to. Says Obama's plan is dangerous.
Obama says that McCain is mischaracterizing his position. He says the idea is that we don't expect to solve every problem before talks. Says Bush recognizes this.
McCain mocking Obama's comments now: "Let me get this straight... Ahbejiminad (sp.) says were going to wipe Israel off the face of the Earth and we say, no you're not?" DANG!
Now there's a disagreement about what Kissinger would say. McCain says Kissinger would be interested in Obama's depiction of his views. He says he would not say that Presidential level should meet like that. Says Obama is parsing words. Obama says now, he's using words McCain's advisors use.
- New topic: Russia.
Obama says the Russian approach has to be reevaluated. Says they're a threat to stability in the region and their actions in Russia were unwarranted. Need unified alliance. Explain they cannot be a 21st Century superpower and act like that. Says Georgia and Ukraine should be allowed in NATO, if them meet requirements. Also cannot return to Cold War with Russia. Says they have lots of nukes and ability to make more. Have to deal with nuclear proliferation. You deal with Russia based on what our national security interests are, not by staring into their soul.
McCain's turn: Says Obama said both side should show restraint during Georgia conflict. Says that was naive. Says Obama didn't understand that Russia commited serious aggression against Georgia. Says Russia is KGB run. Says he doesn't believe we'll return to Cold War. Need to bolster friends and allies. Says former Russian countries are showing solidarity but are concerned about Russian threats. Says Russians ought to understand that we'll support Ukraine and Georgia in NATO. Russia is in violation of thier cease fire agreement by still being in Georgian territory. Says we want to work with Russians but they need to respect international boundaries and norms of international behaviour. Says this has a lot to do with Ukraine and we need to watch them.
Obama says that he thinks they mostly agree on this issue, except that he disagrees that the notion that he somehow that he did not forcefully disagree with the actions of Russia. Says he called for $1 billion to help Georgia, which they have gotten. Says we need to anticipate these problems. Said he warned the Administration in April that there were Russian peacekeepers in Georgia. About energy... says Putin is feeling powerful before of oil dollars. Says we need an energy strategy because of other, not-so-friendly countries. Says he has a plan for alternative energy choices. Says McCain voted 23 times against alternative energy choices.
McCain says Obama is against reprocessing and storing (of nuclear waste), which Obama denies.
- One more question... what do they think the likelihood of another 9/11 type attack?
McCain says it's less likely now than after 9/11. He thinks the nation is safer but a long way from safe. Says he and Joe Lieberman started a commission after 9/11 to investigate what happened and fix it. Says adminstration opposed that. But after familes came, they got the legislation passed. He says he got most of the suggestions from that commision into law. Says intelligent services must do better. Says we should never torture a prisoner again. Says we need to work more closely with our allies. He thinks American is safer but have a long way to go.
Obama's turn... he thinks we are safer in some ways. Airport security, potential targets... but a long way to go. Chemical sites, transit, ports need more work. But it's not a missle we need to worry about, it's a suitcase which is why nuclear proliferation is so important. Says we're spending billions on missle defense and we need that, but he also thinks that we need to spend more on nuclear proliferation. Also need to focus on Al Qaida. Can't focus just on Iraq. Need to focus on Afghanistan and Pakistan. Also need to change the way we are perceive in the world and need to improve our standing and improve our respect. Because of mistakes we have made we have to restore the sense that we are that shining beacon on a hill.
McCain... says Obama does not understand that if we fail in Iraq that it helps Al Qaida. Can't set a goal. Says Obama's plan of specific dates for withdrawal without certain ground conditions ... can't do that.
Obama... says for the last 8 years that the administration has been solely focused on Iraq. Says Bin Laden is still out there and Al Qaida is resurgent. Says were borrowing bilions from China. Says they hold a trillion dollars of our debt and China is active in Latin America, Asia and we are not because we've been focuse on Iraq. We have weakened our capacity to project power around the world because we have viewed everything through this single lens. Says we cannot invest in anything other than Iraq. Says Vets cannot get treatment. Says we're not talking about losing the war. Says next President needs broader vision.
McCain again... says he's been involved in every major security problem for the past 20 years. Says Obama doesn't have experience and Obama's made the wrong judgements in initial reaction to Georgian conflict. Says Obama is clinging to belief that Iraq surge did not work. Needs more flexibility. Says vets know he'll take care of them. Says he has ability and knowledge to keep country safe and secure. Says he doesn't need on the job training.
Obama closing... says his father came from Kenya and came to college here in the US becaue there was no other country on Earth where you could make it if you tried. Says our standing in the world now is not the same. Says what next President has to do is to send a message to the world that we will invest in education, how ordinary people are able to live out their dreams.
McCain... almost finished... says when he came back from Vietnam, he saw vets being treated badly. Says he'll heal the wounds of war.
THE END!
Next Thursday, the VP Debate!
